DNA


Bob Elder
 

I have had my DNA done twice, once by FTDNA &  Ancestry both times I have not had a hit on my family name. I have had 67 markers with FTDNA with McClelland family no connection found,  3 hits with  a 2/3rd cousin on ancestry with no hits with my family.

 

Is having your DNA really worth it.

 

Bob

 


Bret Busby
 

On 4/11/21 4:48 pm, Bob Elder via groups.io wrote:
I have had my DNA done twice, once by FTDNA &  Ancestry both times I have not had a hit on my family name. I have had 67 markers with FTDNA with McClelland family no connection found,  3 hits with  a 2/3^rd cousin on ancestry with no hits with my family.
Is having your DNA really worth it.
Bob
We all have DNA - it is part of us (an essential part).
:)

Whether genealogical DNA testing is "worth it", depends on what tests are done, whether the person can afford the costs involved, and, what are the person's expectations and willingness to pursue the outcome.

See my post a short while ago, on the thread relating to ancestry, about this.

I would not spend the extra money, on a Y-DNA test beyond the Y37 test at familytreedna.com.

Whilst the Y67 test is apparently, no longer offered by familytreedna.com (as with the Y25 test), I believe that the Y67 test cost about 90USD more than the y37test, and, I would have recommended instead, getting the Y37 test in conjunction with the Family Finder test (the Family Finder test is usually 79USD, currently discounted to 59USD).

I currently have a Y37 test and a Family Finder test, that are done for me. On the first, I have not yet found useful matches. On the second, I have so far, found a sixth cousin, related through one of my non-patrilineal ancestral lines.

I regard the use of the genealogical DNA testing, from two different aspects; the first, is the realistic one - where a match is found, the match indicates a probabilistic relationship; it indicates the probability of a relationship, and, does NOT indicate a definite relationship, and, the second, is that, if no match is yet found, the "If you build it, they will come" principle applies, in that, it is a faith based perspective, in that it is the hope that some day, someone related, will undergo the appropriate test, and, thence, a match will be found, leading to research that establishes that a relationship exists. In that, it is like the principle of buying a lottery ticket - if you do not buy the lottery ticket, you can not win a prize, but, if you do buy a lottery ticket, you might win a prize - you are then, "in with a chance".

There is never any guarantee that an unknown relative will have undergone, or, will undergo, genealogical DNA testing through the same facility, but, if you do not undergo the test(s), you will never have the opportunity of finding an unknown relative this way.

An interesting perspective to this, is that, if a person has undergone genealogical testing (the autosomal testing, and the Y-DNA testing, if male), and, the person has the person's genealogy, including that the person has undergone genealogical DNA testing, and, which particular tests, published on a facility such as wikitree, and, another person who may be related, finds that genealogy on wikitree, and, in finding that the first person has undergone the tests, thence undergoes an appropriate test, and, a match, and, thence, a probable relationship, is found, then, consider for yourself; is the testing "worth it" ?

As I stated above;
"
Whether genealogical DNA testing is "worth it", depends on what tests are done, whether the person can afford the costs involved, and, what are the person's expectations and willingness to pursue the outcome.
"

--
Bret Busby
Genealogical DNA Research Participant and Campaigner
Armadale
West Australia
(UTC+0800)
..............


Edie Mc
 

Bret, I think it is worth going for the Y111 straight up although, Familytreedn say to do the Y37 before the Y111 to se if you have a match. I did the Y67 first up as I know you can have a heap of names with Y37 and it is like a jungle is you haven’t found your surname you are familiar with, but know one of the strange names appear could be yours, but don’t know which is which.  Going for the higr  marker sorts out the false positives and you don’t have so many names at the end with the Y111 and it is a clearer picture.  It needs to be under 7 steps to be a relative though. 0 is the closest.  With the Y111 even though they do not do the 67 marker anymore, you do get the 25, 37, and the 67 marker along with the  Y111. I wouldn’t do the Big y 700 though unless you are an expert as it doesn’t define your markers Y111 is the highest marker.  My son did the BigY 700 and it hasn’t done a thing to help us.

 

I do think it is worth while Bob, as it has maybe alerted you to the fact, your family at some stage in the past  have changed their name for some reason.  As I said since you have done a Y67 marker and entitled to do a Project or so.  It is like doing a one name search. Though I think that you would have had  such a match if there were any  of your family in the Project, but at least it will give you an idea of how many Mclellands in the project, you are not matching with and may have to start searching to see if any name changes somewhere further back in time.   Where to start is the problem.  You could also  do a Location search on ancestry, it is on the top right hand side don’t put in a surname, just see if you can see if anyone has come from the location you know your furthest Maclelland came from  as maybe that is a a way to find your DNA family name. I have done it with say Polmont, Stirlingshire to see how many of the strange names that come up belong to our Laing family.  It is a good way of pairing up to known family names. I color code my surnames on ancestry as well.  It is a easy way to  keep track of who is who and where they fit int the family groups.  I have one say for a person who id definialey supposed to be a DNA match and is Scottish as I type in Scotland in the search area, again no name and then see who is Scottish, but an unknown, so I have an unknown Scottish colour group. It is getting relies that can be a problem.  The location factor is a good help though.

Edie

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 

From: Bret Busby
Sent: Friday, 5 November 2021 1:38
To: Scots@Scotland-Genealogy.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ScotGen] DNA

 

On 4/11/21 4:48 pm, Bob Elder via groups.io wrote:

> I have had my DNA done twice, once by FTDNA &  Ancestry both times I

> have not had a hit on my family name. I have had 67 markers with FTDNA

> with McClelland family no connection found,  3 hits with  a 2/3^rd

> cousin on ancestry with no hits with my family.

>

> Is having your DNA really worth it.

>

> Bob

>

 

We all have DNA - it is part of us (an essential part).

  :)

 

Whether genealogical DNA testing is "worth it", depends on what tests

are done, whether the person can afford the costs involved, and, what

are the person's expectations and willingness to pursue the outcome.

 

See my post a short while ago, on the thread relating to ancestry, about

this.

 

I would not spend the extra money, on a Y-DNA test beyond the Y37 test

at familytreedna.com.

 

Whilst the Y67 test is apparently, no longer offered by

familytreedna.com (as with the Y25 test), I believe that the Y67 test

cost about 90USD more than the y37test, and, I would have recommended

instead, getting the Y37 test in conjunction with the Family Finder test

(the Family Finder test is usually 79USD, currently discounted to 59USD).

 

I currently have a Y37 test and a Family Finder test, that are done for

me.  On the first, I have not yet found useful matches. On the second, I

have so far, found a sixth cousin, related through one of my

non-patrilineal ancestral lines.

 

I regard the use of the genealogical DNA testing, from two different

aspects; the first, is the realistic one - where a match is found, the

match indicates a probabilistic relationship; it indicates the

probability of a relationship, and, does NOT indicate a definite

relationship, and, the second, is that, if no match is yet found, the

"If you build it, they will come" principle applies, in that, it is a

faith based perspective, in that it is the hope that some day, someone

related, will undergo the appropriate test, and, thence, a match will be

found, leading to research that establishes that a relationship exists.

In that, it is like the principle of buying a lottery ticket - if you do

not buy the lottery ticket, you can not win a prize, but, if you do buy

a lottery ticket, you might win a prize - you are then, "in with a chance".

 

There is never any guarantee that an unknown relative will have

undergone, or, will undergo, genealogical DNA testing through the same

facility, but, if you do not undergo the test(s), you will never have

the opportunity of finding an unknown relative this way.

 

An interesting perspective to this, is that, if a person has undergone

genealogical testing (the autosomal testing, and the Y-DNA testing, if

male), and, the person has the person's genealogy,  including that the

person has undergone genealogical DNA testing, and, which particular

tests, published on a facility such as wikitree, and, another person who

may be related, finds that genealogy on wikitree, and, in finding that

the first person has undergone the tests, thence undergoes an

appropriate test, and, a match, and, thence, a probable relationship, is

found, then, consider for yourself; is the testing "worth it" ?

 

As I stated above;

"

Whether genealogical DNA testing is "worth it", depends on what tests

are done, whether the person can afford the costs involved, and, what

are the person's expectations and willingness to pursue the outcome.

"

 

--

Bret Busby

Genealogical DNA Research Participant and Campaigner

Armadale

West Australia

(UTC+0800)

..............

 

 

 

 

 

 


--
EdieMc


Edie Mc
 

HI Bret,

I have personally paid for one, My Heritage DNA, one familyfinder for myself, five Ancestry DNA, plus 3 Y67, upgrading all three to Y111 famiytreedna. I am not made of money I am a pensioner, but I needed folk to do a DNA test for me ad you cant expect them to fork uot for something , they have no real interest in, so I over time about five years, have paid out for the DNA kits. Many matches later though not the two I want, I may get there one day. But you can combine the cost of a DNA kit between several folk.  Sale on at the moment, for the all male line at familytreedan

Edie.

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 

From: Bret Busby
Sent: Friday, 5 November 2021 1:38
To: Scots@Scotland-Genealogy.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ScotGen] DNA

 

On 4/11/21 4:48 pm, Bob Elder via groups.io wrote:

> I have had my DNA done twice, once by FTDNA &  Ancestry both times I

> have not had a hit on my family name. I have had 67 markers with FTDNA

> with McClelland family no connection found,  3 hits with  a 2/3^rd

> cousin on ancestry with no hits with my family.

>

> Is having your DNA really worth it.

>

> Bob

>

 

We all have DNA - it is part of us (an essential part).

  :)

 

Whether genealogical DNA testing is "worth it", depends on what tests

are done, whether the person can afford the costs involved, and, what

are the person's expectations and willingness to pursue the outcome.

 

See my post a short while ago, on the thread relating to ancestry, about

this.

 

I would not spend the extra money, on a Y-DNA test beyond the Y37 test

at familytreedna.com.

 

Whilst the Y67 test is apparently, no longer offered by

familytreedna.com (as with the Y25 test), I believe that the Y67 test

cost about 90USD more than the y37test, and, I would have recommended

instead, getting the Y37 test in conjunction with the Family Finder test

(the Family Finder test is usually 79USD, currently discounted to 59USD).

 

I currently have a Y37 test and a Family Finder test, that are done for

me.  On the first, I have not yet found useful matches. On the second, I

have so far, found a sixth cousin, related through one of my

non-patrilineal ancestral lines.

 

 


--
EdieMc


Edie Mc
 

Could McCelland was an inherited name from generations back.  Or maybe there was adoption generations ago. My own maiden name of PLACE didn’t appear on FamilytreeDNA or ancestry, then I had a break through on ancestry and the BARTON name suddenly came through with a 194cm match with a lady who I share a match with.  I share a match with a husband and wife who are my 2nd  Great Grandparents, I don’t know which of their seven sons is my great grandfather. They were Colonel William Robert  BARTON and his wife Ann BOGUES.  I never knew until my early seventies my grandfather was illegitimate.   The third great grandfather was Scottish and the fourth Irish apparently.  Do an upgrade to Y111 it will narrow the surnames righ down, we had a few names and it came down to three names down then come back to ancestry and you may see your DNA surname. I did a Y111 on my brother and straight away there were only three names all to do with BARTON.  I have had many matches since with BARTON and BOGUES.  My maiden name was Place. There hasn’t been one Place with either companies, so maybe you are the same and not a true McClelland. Worth trying Bob.

Edie McArthur

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 

From: Bob Elder via groups.io
Sent: Thursday, 4 November 2021 19:48
To: Scots@Scotland-Genealogy.groups.io
Subject: [ScotGen] DNA

 

I have had my DNA done twice, once by FTDNA &  Ancestry both times I have not had a hit on my family name. I have had 67 markers with FTDNA with McClelland family no connection found,  3 hits with  a 2/3rd cousin on ancestry with no hits with my family.

 

Is having your DNA really worth it.

 

Bob

 

 


--
EdieMc


kengray1000@...
 

Over the last few years, I have used FTDNA for Y25 all the way to BigY700 and also Family Finder. I have found a few cousins and validated some paper records which has been great. I have yet to find a match to my Surname, Gray. However, all the way through the various YDNA tests I had a very close match to Ramsay. Apparently, a common ancestor within the last 300 years. We communicated and shared our records and discovered both our families were located in the same area of Scotland. It looks like one of us was an out of wedlock incident and that secret has gone to the grave with someone. We will never know what happened.

Still waiting for more close matches in either surname.


Edie Mc
 

Maybe you could join the Maclellan Clan Project, I think it is a variant of Maclelland.  You have done a 67 marker so are eligible to join the project free.  I noted that there are about six other names that have origins with the Clan Maclellan, so maybe yours could be one of those.

https://www.familytreedna.com/groups/mcclellan-project/about/background

 

Edie

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 

From: Bob Elder via groups.io
Sent: Thursday, 4 November 2021 19:48
To: Scots@Scotland-Genealogy.groups.io
Subject: [ScotGen] DNA

 

I have had my DNA done twice, once by FTDNA &  Ancestry both times I have not had a hit on my family name. I have had 67 markers with FTDNA with McClelland family no connection found,  3 hits with  a 2/3rd cousin on ancestry with no hits with my family.

 

Is having your DNA really worth it.

 

Bob

 

 


--
EdieMc


Edie Mc
 

Have you tested your DNA with ancestry, as maybe you will see a match there that has your  surnames in their tree if any tree, or a shared match. It wasn’t until I did my autosomal with ancestry that I noted our DNA surname  of BARTON was in the familytreedna all along. You are looking for your birth surname not for some other name unfamiliar to you so it is easy not to notice.

 

I went looking in my family finder last night after reading your email.  I just don’t like it.  So many folk, do not put any surnames up to compare with, or no trees, or any information of any kind. You just cannot do anything with them at all. Didn’t find anything extra for my John McArthur.  Like a lot of people I have nothing to go on, other than a marriage certificate, if everything on that certificate is correct.

 

I cant hep feeling that something will turn up one day.  We don’t even have our relative on a census as yet.  The 1841 or 1851. I keep thinking Military. There are a few  the right time frame, but which one.  Other than fold3, Ihavent engaged a researcher to do any work.

 

Edie

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 

From: kengray1000@...
Sent: Saturday, 6 November 2021 21:28
To: Scots@Scotland-Genealogy.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ScotGen] DNA

 

Over the last few years, I have used FTDNA for Y25 all the way to BigY700 and also Family Finder. I have found a few cousins and validated some paper records which has been great. I have yet to find a match to my Surname, Gray. However, all the way through the various YDNA tests I had a very close match to Ramsay. Apparently, a common ancestor within the last 300 years. We communicated and shared our records and discovered both our families were located in the same area of Scotland. It looks like one of us was an out of wedlock incident and that secret has gone to the grave with someone. We will never know what happened.

Still waiting for more close matches in either surname.

 


--
EdieMc


 

Hi Ken. Reply inline.

On Sat, Nov 6, 2021 at 3:28 AM <kengray1000@...> wrote:

Over the last few years, I have used FTDNA for Y25 all the way to BigY700 and also Family Finder. I have found a few cousins and validated some paper records which has been great.


Me too. It's quite fun. However, autosomal (Family Finder) is a whole different game than Y DNA. With Y, you need to recruit testers, because it really is a team sport. It takes some work to build your tree down from the ancestor in question to the present, and find eligible testers -- sons of sons of sons. If you don't recruit, you have to rely on chance to answer your research questions. 
 

I have yet to find a match to my Surname, Gray. However, all the way through the various YDNA tests I had a very close match to Ramsay. Apparently, a common ancestor within the last 300 years. We communicated and shared our records and discovered both our families were located in the same area of Scotland. It looks like one of us was an out of wedlock incident and that secret has gone to the grave with someone. We will never know what happened.


Have you joined both surname projects on Family Tree DNA? Not only is Y research a team sport, your projects are the coaches, staff and cheer squad. You need them! See https://learn.familytreedna.com/group-projects/family-tree-dna-group-projects-charge-money-run-belong-one/ for more information. I would have gotten nowhere with my Cowans without the Cowan group; same with McBee.
 

Still waiting for more close matches in either surname.


You can wait a long time...... 

Valorie

--
http://about.me/valoriez - pronouns: she/her


 

Hi Bob, you are looking only for Elder in Ancestry.com? That strategy will not get you very far.

Most of your matches will not share your surname. My birth surname is Cowan. I just checked Ancestry and I have over 42,000 matches. A search for Cowan surname gets 6 matches. And to be truthful, I have few DNA Cowan matches in my tree, because my grandfather Cowan came from Ontario, Canada and testing in Canada is not nearly as common as here. I've one very distant Cowan Scots match, but so distant we have no clue how. The Canadians I've been able to figure out. 

Now my mother's McBee matches are more numerous, although they rarely have the McBee surname, except those who tested their Y DNA! 5 matches with the McBee surname on Ancestry.com -- but I have added lots and lots of McBees to my tree as DNA matches. 

My most enormous group of matches are my mother's Baysingers who came to Pennsylvania in 1770 and all seemed to have had a dozen children. 17 have the Baysinger surname, out of hundreds of matches. I've built my tree down from my second great grandparents, and partially done the third great grandparents so I recognize lots of the other associated surnames -- and I add each known match to my tree. That is key to success in using autosomal DNA.

The key to Y DNA is to recruit testers to join your surname project on Family Tree DNA, and work with your project leader.

I disagree with Bret on the value of Big Y -- it has been worth every cent my cousin and I have spent!  My daddy's Big Y is absolutely priceless, now that he's passed. Like anything else in life, it takes work to create success in family history research.

Valorie


On Thu, Nov 4, 2021 at 1:48 AM Bob Elder via groups.io <relder=tiscali.co.uk@groups.io> wrote:

I have had my DNA done twice, once by FTDNA &  Ancestry both times I have not had a hit on my family name. I have had 67 markers with FTDNA with McClelland family no connection found,  3 hits with  a 2/3rd cousin on ancestry with no hits with my family.

 

Is having your DNA really worth it.

 

Bob


--
http://about.me/valoriez - pronouns: she/her


Ken Harrison
 

Valorie,
I think you intended this to go to a different Ken? 

Ken Harrison

On Nov 7, 2021, at 10:11 PM, Valorie Zimmerman <valorie.zimmerman@...> wrote:


Hi Ken. Reply inline.

On Sat, Nov 6, 2021 at 3:28 AM <kengray1000@...> wrote:

Over the last few years, I have used FTDNA for Y25 all the way to BigY700 and also Family Finder. I have found a few cousins and validated some paper records which has been great.


Me too. It's quite fun. However, autosomal (Family Finder) is a whole different game than Y DNA. With Y, you need to recruit testers, because it really is a team sport. It takes some work to build your tree down from the ancestor in question to the present, and find eligible testers -- sons of sons of sons. If you don't recruit, you have to rely on chance to answer your research questions. 
 

I have yet to find a match to my Surname, Gray. However, all the way through the various YDNA tests I had a very close match to Ramsay. Apparently, a common ancestor within the last 300 years. We communicated and shared our records and discovered both our families were located in the same area of Scotland. It looks like one of us was an out of wedlock incident and that secret has gone to the grave with someone. We will never know what happened.


Have you joined both surname projects on Family Tree DNA? Not only is Y research a team sport, your projects are the coaches, staff and cheer squad. You need them! See https://learn.familytreedna.com/group-projects/family-tree-dna-group-projects-charge-money-run-belong-one/ for more information. I would have gotten nowhere with my Cowans without the Cowan group; same with McBee.
 

Still waiting for more close matches in either surname.


You can wait a long time...... 

Valorie

--
http://about.me/valoriez - pronouns: she/her


kengray1000@...
 

Hi

 

Agreed. I have joined all sorts of surname groups over the thirty odd years I've been doing this, DNA only for the last seven years. It is only the DNA testing which shows that the paper records don't always show the whole story. 

I need more of my family, rule of three, to do more DNA resting, sadly I appear to be the only one in my family with this level of interest and cost is not an issue. I find with the DNA testing that is the ex pats who are keen to find their Scotish roots, not so the ones who didn't move out of Scotland. Thet already know they are Scottish.

I am however having fun connecting with cousins of various distance from the USA, Canada etc.

I have patience.

Ken


Janice McClelland
 

Hi Bob - my husband is a McClelland and has Ancestry DNA results. I just searched for "Elder" in his DNA connections - there are three. Are you connected to JElder5000, Angela Elder Smith or sam_elder29 by any chance? 
Jan


Janice McClelland
 

Sorry - I fibbed! There are a few additional Elders - Jacob Elder, R.E. and M.E. making a total of 6 known Elder connections. 
Jan


Edie Mc
 

Yes, we too have connected with Canadian Stevensons originally from Scotland roots.  One was an adopted child.  His mother Ann Stevenson had married a farmer in USA, they had a son, Ann had died not long after.  The farmer was unable to care for the son and he was adopted by another farmer and his wife.  The whole story was in the Find a Grave for the adoptive father. As I have a large tree up for Rob, the match from the adopted son easily found us.

 

I haven’t had any trouble finding family to do a test for me. I pay for the tests, they have nothing more to do with it.

Edie

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 

From: kengray1000@...
Sent: Monday, 8 November 2021 22:31
To: Scots@Scotland-Genealogy.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ScotGen] DNA

 

Hi

 

Agreed. I have joined all sorts of surname groups over the thirty odd years I've been doing this, DNA only for the last seven years. It is only the DNA testing which shows that the paper records don't always show the whole story. 

I need more of my family, rule of three, to do more DNA resting, sadly I appear to be the only one in my family with this level of interest and cost is not an issue. I find with the DNA testing that is the ex pats who are keen to find their Scotish roots, not so the ones who didn't move out of Scotland. Thet already know they are Scottish.

I am however having fun connecting with cousins of various distance from the USA, Canada etc.

I have patience.

Ken

 


--
EdieMc


Edie Mc
 

Hi Valorie,

Next question is, can you explain the value of the Big Y700 as my son and I cant see it.  We can  see where all of the five surnames that are part of the same lineage as McArthurs sit on the scale created on Big Y700, but it hasn’t helped one bit.  In which way has it helped you  please as you obviously are more savvy bout it?

 

He was encouraged to do the Big Y700, but we have both been very disappointed as it costs hundreds of dollars.  He hasn’t got any further ahead than me spending money for the Y111.  We are told it doesn’t define the Y111 marker any further.  So what have you found that is helpful.  Yes I know this isn’t a DNA list but I genuinely would like to know how it has helped you, please

Thanks

Edie

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 

From: Valorie Zimmerman
Sent: Monday, 8 November 2021 17:29
To: Scots@scotland-genealogy.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ScotGen] DNA

 

I disagree with Bret on the value of Big Y -- it has been worth every cent my cousin and I have spent!  My daddy's Big Y is absolutely priceless, now that he's passed. Like anything else in life, it takes work to create success in family history research.

 

Valorie

 

On Thu, Nov 4, 2021 at 1:48 AM Bob Elder via groups.io <relder=tiscali.co.uk@groups.io> wrote:

I have had my DNA done twice, once by FTDNA &  Ancestry both times I have not had a hit on my family name. I have had 67 markers with FTDNA with McClelland family no connection found,  3 hits with  a 2/3rd cousin on ancestry with no hits with my family.

 

Is having your DNA really worth it.

 

Bob

 

--

http://about.me/valoriez - pronouns: she/her

 


--
EdieMc


 

Hi Edie, sorry I missed this at the time. Big Y does cost hundreds of dollars, although an upgrade to an existing Y test, especially during sale periods, is less expensive. Still, I have found every dollar spent so far,  valuable. 

You mention the "five surnames that are part of the same lineage as McArthurs sit on the scale created on Big Y700" -- that is a family tree, although it does not look like the sort of tree we are used to. There is a series of 3 one-hour videos to a New Mexico genealogy society that really opened my eyes to the value of this sort of testing, along with *lots* of genealogy research. 


I've heard lots of other lectures since which discuss using the same methodology, including with Irish and Scots clans. Part of what sets Y DNA testing apart from autosomal is that it is a "team sport." To answer specific questions about your lineage, such as from which brother did the male line descend, 100 or even a thousand years ago, you need male testers from as many of those brothers as possible. The further back in time, the more likely you are to find other testers' results, although all of them do not have the paper research to help you answer that question, so just as in autosomal DNA research, you will have to create trees for the matches. For the closer-in-time questions, perhaps some testers already have tested, and just need to upgrade to Big Y, and some you may have to recruit. 

"He hasn’t got any further ahead than me spending money for the Y111.  We are told it doesn’t define the Y111 marker any further."

It does, in a way, in that you now know the "terminal SNP". For instances, my father's is R-BY3644. We could further define SNP that by testing some Cowan cousins, and I do plan to do that. The so-called 'rule of three' is that you want to test someone close, such as a second cousin on the same male line who is already in your tree, and then the most distant paternal-line cousin on your tree. I'm in hope of recruiting a German Zimmermann to further define my husband's Zimmerman line. Loads of other Zimmerman/Carpenter testers, but so far, only Bob and his brother in their own unusual line (G-FT19545).

Y DNA testing is a long game, and requires lots of patience. I first tested my daddy in 2003! I'm so happy that FTDNA was able to upgrade that old kit to Big Y, because he passed in 2016.

Thanks so much for asking such detailed questions. I'm not sure I would call myself savvy, but I do enjoy learning more about it, more about my family, and the research that others are doing too.

Valorie


On Wed, Nov 10, 2021 at 12:17 AM Edie Mc <eamca1944@...> wrote:

Hi Valorie,

Next question is, can you explain the value of the Big Y700 as my son and I cant see it.  We can  see where all of the five surnames that are part of the same lineage as McArthurs sit on the scale created on Big Y700, but it hasn’t helped one bit.  In which way has it helped you  please as you obviously are more savvy bout it?

 

He was encouraged to do the Big Y700, but we have both been very disappointed as it costs hundreds of dollars.  He hasn’t got any further ahead than me spending money for the Y111.  We are told it doesn’t define the Y111 marker any further.  So what have you found that is helpful.  Yes I know this isn’t a DNA list but I genuinely would like to know how it has helped you, please

Thanks

Edie

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 

From: Valorie Zimmerman
Sent: Monday, 8 November 2021 17:29
To: Scots@scotland-genealogy.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ScotGen] DNA

 

I disagree with Bret on the value of Big Y -- it has been worth every cent my cousin and I have spent!  My daddy's Big Y is absolutely priceless, now that he's passed. Like anything else in life, it takes work to create success in family history research.

 

Valorie

 

--

http://about.me/valoriez - pronouns: she/her

 


--
EdieMc

--
http://about.me/valoriez - pronouns: she/her


Edie Mc
 

Hi Val,

 

We still haven’t found one McArthur match except for our own family.  We have a 7 step Morrison since he upgraded to Big Y, but he doesn’t reply to emails and he doesn’t have any details whatever. Just when you think you have a clue, you cant get anywhere unless your emails have a reply. We have done the projects but no luck there either. I am not worried if the match turns out to be some other surname, so long as it is a close match and something to work with, like what happened with my brothers all male line.  We found we were Bartons and we had three matches at the Y111 level.  But again, if your family turns out to be illegitimate, no one is interested.  We did get a good amount of information from a good match at the start but that was that. They had written a book and we could see who our second great grandparents were, we matched with husband and wife, there were seven sons and a photograph of all of them. So I ws satisfied with that, but nothing on the McArthur line.

 

We know John McArthur was in Cathcart in Renfrew just prior to his marriage to Isabella Stevenson, their banns were read  16th November 1856, then they were married at Cambuslang 2 December in the Established Church of Scotland and that  is basically it, until they arrived in Tasmania.  I am interested in a family of Smiths in Cathcart Graveyard.  The daughter Margaret Smith died August 1856, a few months before John and Isabella left the district. Her father James Smith died in 1855 and her mother Margaret Muir, in  1835. James had a son James Smith a Police commissioner, in Glasgow. Johns father is Duncan McArthur and there was a Duncan McArthur also a policeman in the Cathcart Census of 185 along with other McArthurs in the Police force.  There may be no connection, but I need to try to find out and then illiminate.

 

I will get my son to take a look at the utube  lectures though. Thanks

 

Thanks for responding Valerie

Edie McArthur

 

 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows

 

From: Valorie Zimmerman
Sent: Wednesday, 1 December 2021 12:08
To: Scots@scotland-genealogy.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ScotGen] DNA

 

Hi Edie, sorry I missed this at the time. Big Y does cost hundreds of dollars, although an upgrade to an existing Y test, especially during sale periods, is less expensive. Still, I have found every dollar spent so far,  valuable. 

 

You mention the "five surnames that are part of the same lineage as McArthurs sit on the scale created on Big Y700" -- that is a family tree, although it does not look like the sort of tree we are used to. There is a series of 3 one-hour videos to a New Mexico genealogy society that really opened my eyes to the value of this sort of testing, along with *lots* of genealogy research. 

 

 

I've heard lots of other lectures since which discuss using the same methodology, including with Irish and Scots clans. Part of what sets Y DNA testing apart from autosomal is that it is a "team sport." To answer specific questions about your lineage, such as from which brother did the male line descend, 100 or even a thousand years ago, you need male testers from as many of those brothers as possible. The further back in time, the more likely you are to find other testers' results, although all of them do not have the paper research to help you answer that question, so just as in autosomal DNA research, you will have to create trees for the matches. For the closer-in-time questions, perhaps some testers already have tested, and just need to upgrade to Big Y, and some you may have to recruit. 

 

 


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EdieMc


Bret Busby
 

On 1/12/21 8:51 pm, Edie Mc wrote:
Hi Val,
We still haven’t found one McArthur match except for our own family.  We have a 7 step Morrison since he upgraded to Big Y, but he doesn’t reply to emails and he doesn’t have any details whatever.
Hello, Edie.

I am curious - in what country, is your Morrison?

In my Busby line in New Zealand, we have a branch that involves Morrisons, in Northland.

--
Bret Busby
Genealogical DNA Research Participant and Campaigner
Armadale
West Australia
(UTC+0800)
..............


Lauraine Syrnick
 

Hi - have Morrison in my family - a Forbes Morrison b. 1740-1750. He would be my 4x great grandfather and borne to a John Morrison and ? Cowie. Unsure of last name but can look it up if you are interested. This man was a fisherman living on Shetland, Scotland and had a daughter Ursula Morrison who married a James Smith in Shetland.

Lauraine (Smith-5003) Syrnick

On Dec 1, 2021, at 7:26 AM, Bret Busby <bret@...> wrote:

On 1/12/21 8:51 pm, Edie Mc wrote:
Hi Val,
We still haven’t found one McArthur match except for our own family. We have a 7 step Morrison since he upgraded to Big Y, but he doesn’t reply to emails and he doesn’t have any details whatever.
Hello, Edie.

I am curious - in what country, is your Morrison?

In my Busby line in New Zealand, we have a branch that involves Morrisons, in Northland.

--
Bret Busby
Genealogical DNA Research Participant and Campaigner
Armadale
West Australia
(UTC+0800)
..............