Date   

Re: John Murdoch + Islay emigrants

candy@...
 

I got quite excited when this popped on on my emails mentioning John Murdoch of Islay.  Then realised it was not my Rev John Murdoch first pastor of the Round Church in Bowmore.  He had 11 children and only know of 2 marriages, the one of which I descended (Thomas) and Charlotte who married who married Neil Currie. They had a John b 1771 and two other males Archibald 1758 and Patrick 1768. The last two children would have been born on Islay (John 1771 and Jean 1772) as he only arrived on Islay around 1769.  

Wondering if maybe this John Murdoch you mention would some connection.  I have heard of this John a few times, but as I have been unable to conclusively find any indication of marriages or deaths of Rev John's children so far it would be hard to tell.  

Will need to get back to this side of the family and see what I can find.


Re Toni's email,: [Islay] John Murdoch + Islay emigrants

Marion Larmer
 

Your Email is most interesting.
My McDougald and Campbell ancestors came from Nosbridge   and Mulindry, Parish of Bowmore
in 1841 and 1847.It is always good to read info on that area.
Thanks -and all the best to you-Toni.
Marion Larmer






-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-


Re: John Murdoch + Islay emigrants

John Kemplen
 

Hi Toni

Would it be possible for you to share with us images of the handwritten place and person names, which would allow us to make our own guesses about the letters making up the words?  Some of us are quite used to the letter combinations that you tend to get in Gaelic.  My initial guess about the lady's name would be Ceit Ruadh (Red-headed Kate).

Regards

John


On 14/02/2021 18:39, tsinclair@... wrote:
Hello everyone, and Happy (?) Valentine's Day

I've been reading "For the People's Cause" by James Hunter, based the writings of John Murdoch, Highland and Irish Land Reformer.  Much of his boyhood was spent on Islay, and eventually returned there as an Excise man.  Murdoch wrote about Islay frequently, and Chapter 5, "An Islay Clearance 1859" seems to be completely Murdoch's own perspective.  The book also covers his passion for desperate living conditions throughout the highlands, the unfair treatment of the crofters, and his involvement with "The Highlander" a newspaper echoing his beliefs.  In1879/80 he came to North America where he met up with several Islay emigrants to see for himself how they were faring and to get their impressions of their homeland from their new perspective, which he later wrote about in his editorials.

However, the book seems to cover only excerpts of this travel journal. In Glasgow (probably Mitchell Library) a few years ago, I got my hands on a handwritten copy of the journal of this trip, and was allowed to photocopy a few pages, and I photographed some more pages which were relevant to my own research. In it he refers on two occasions to a place on Islay - once to John Sinclair, son of Neil Sinclair of Torranhungari (sp?), and also "Here we had several of the Torrantungary (sp?) Sinclairs and the sons of Cest Ruadh (sp?) and her husband Donald Brown, originally from Teana shefoi_g (spelling actually could be anything).  Does anyone in this group know about this Brown family?   I know that the above Neil and family lived at Neriby farm before emigrating to Ontario in 1842/43.  Their oldest daughter, Catherine married Donald Brown in May of 1829, and their oldest son, Dugald was born there in 1832.  The Browns emigrated first to Cape Breton in 1833 and the rest of their children were born there. Later (1850s) they migrated to Fenelon township, Ontario to join the Sinclair family when old Neil died.


I've looked everywhere for "Torranhungary" on old Islay maps and tenant lists, but can't find it anywhere.  Could this be a Gaelic version of Neriby or another township in that vicinity?   He was certainly an advocate for saving the Gaelic language!


Finally, I'll try to read any other name I can find on these pages, and type up a list of them.  If any of you recognise them, I'll be happy to give you any further details which Murdoch mentioned.
Toni



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Re: John Murdoch + Islay emigrants

Sue Visser
 

Just grasping at straws here ...

The Torra River (north of Glenegedale) - perhaps that's the first part.

Ruadh - red haired?

Perhaps some help from Gaelic speakers can solve a couple of the problems.

Interesting project - good luck,
Sue Visser

-----Original Message-----
From: tsinclair@nexicom.net
Sent: Sunday, February 14, 2021 1:39 PM
To: Islay@scotland-genealogy.groups.io
Subject: [Islay] John Murdoch + Islay emigrants

Hello everyone, and Happy (?) Valentine's Day

I've been reading "For the People's Cause" by James Hunter, based the
writings of John Murdoch, Highland and Irish Land Reformer. Much of
his boyhood was spent on Islay, and eventually returned there as an
Excise man. Murdoch wrote about Islay frequently, and Chapter 5, "An
Islay Clearance 1859" seems to be completely Murdoch's own
perspective. The book also covers his passion for desperate living
conditions throughout the highlands, the unfair treatment of the
crofters, and his involvement with "The Highlander" a newspaper
echoing his beliefs. In1879/80 he came to North America where he met
up with several Islay emigrants to see for himself how they were
faring and to get their impressions of their homeland from their new
perspective, which he later wrote about in his editorials.

However, the book seems to cover only excerpts of this travel journal.
In Glasgow (probably Mitchell Library) a few years ago, I got my
hands on a handwritten copy of the journal of this trip, and was
allowed to photocopy a few pages, and I photographed some more pages
which were relevant to my own research. In it he refers on two
occasions to a place on Islay - once to John Sinclair, son of Neil
Sinclair of Torranhungari (sp?), and also "Here we had several of the
Torrantungary (sp?) Sinclairs and the sons of Cest Ruadh (sp?) and her
husband Donald Brown, originally from Teana shefoi_g (spelling
actually could be anything). Does anyone in this group know about
this Brown family? I know that the above Neil and family lived at
Neriby farm before emigrating to Ontario in 1842/43. Their oldest
daughter, Catherine married Donald Brown in May of 1829, and their
oldest son, Dugald was born there in 1832. The Browns emigrated first
to Cape Breton in 1833 and the rest of their children were born there.
Later (1850s) they migrated to Fenelon township, Ontario to join the
Sinclair family when old Neil died.


I've looked everywhere for "Torranhungary" on old Islay maps and
tenant lists, but can't find it anywhere. Could this be a Gaelic
version of Neriby or another township in that vicinity? He was
certainly an advocate for saving the Gaelic language!


Finally, I'll try to read any other name I can find on these pages,
and type up a list of them. If any of you recognise them, I'll be
happy to give you any further details which Murdoch mentioned.
Toni


John Murdoch + Islay emigrants

tsinclair@...
 

Hello everyone, and Happy (?) Valentine's Day

I've been reading "For the People's Cause" by James Hunter, based the writings of John Murdoch, Highland and Irish Land Reformer. Much of his boyhood was spent on Islay, and eventually returned there as an Excise man. Murdoch wrote about Islay frequently, and Chapter 5, "An Islay Clearance 1859" seems to be completely Murdoch's own perspective. The book also covers his passion for desperate living conditions throughout the highlands, the unfair treatment of the crofters, and his involvement with "The Highlander" a newspaper echoing his beliefs. In1879/80 he came to North America where he met up with several Islay emigrants to see for himself how they were faring and to get their impressions of their homeland from their new perspective, which he later wrote about in his editorials.

However, the book seems to cover only excerpts of this travel journal. In Glasgow (probably Mitchell Library) a few years ago, I got my hands on a handwritten copy of the journal of this trip, and was allowed to photocopy a few pages, and I photographed some more pages which were relevant to my own research. In it he refers on two occasions to a place on Islay - once to John Sinclair, son of Neil Sinclair of Torranhungari (sp?), and also "Here we had several of the Torrantungary (sp?) Sinclairs and the sons of Cest Ruadh (sp?) and her husband Donald Brown, originally from Teana shefoi_g (spelling actually could be anything). Does anyone in this group know about this Brown family? I know that the above Neil and family lived at Neriby farm before emigrating to Ontario in 1842/43. Their oldest daughter, Catherine married Donald Brown in May of 1829, and their oldest son, Dugald was born there in 1832. The Browns emigrated first to Cape Breton in 1833 and the rest of their children were born there. Later (1850s) they migrated to Fenelon township, Ontario to join the Sinclair family when old Neil died.


I've looked everywhere for "Torranhungary" on old Islay maps and tenant lists, but can't find it anywhere. Could this be a Gaelic version of Neriby or another township in that vicinity? He was certainly an advocate for saving the Gaelic language!


Finally, I'll try to read any other name I can find on these pages, and type up a list of them. If any of you recognise them, I'll be happy to give you any further details which Murdoch mentioned.
Toni


Re: Currie / McVurich - please help

Tricia
 


Re: Currie / McVurich - please help

Tricia
 


Re: Currie / McVurich - please help

Chris MacDougall
 

Hi Iain,

Many thanks for sending this to me! I greatly appreciate it. I will be reviewing this in detail, and expanding to include my Jura ancestors that migrated to Islay in the 1840s.

Thank you again!

All the best,

Chris

On Sat, Feb 13, 2021 at 4:34 AM Iain MacIntosh <port.wemyss@...> wrote:

Hi Chris

Christ: I tried to get on to Ted Larson’s pages on Rootsweb, but encountered an error. 

I have attached an Excel spreadsheet of this data which  I downloaded a number of years ago from Steve’s site.

 

Regards

 

Iain MacIntosh

 

 

From: Islay@Scotland-Genealogy.groups.io <Islay@Scotland-Genealogy.groups.io> On Behalf Of Chris MacDougall
Sent: 12 February 2021 17:44
To: Islay@scotland-genealogy.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Islay] Currie / McVurich - please help

 

Hello everyone,

 

I am hunting down a McDougall/Currie link, and I am wondering if any of you might have these people in your respective trees, plus further information.

 

Euphemia (Effie) Currie married Hugh McDougal at Kilmeny in 1855, and they had a daughter named Anne in 1860. There might be other children, I am not sure.

 

The other items I am not sure of are Hugh's parents and Effie's parents. As everyone well knows, the number of McDougalls and Curries on Islay makes this extremely difficult to follow. My own Jura McDougalls went to Islay in the 1840s, also muddying the waters a bit.

 

Any information, or leads for me to research further, that you may have regarding Hugh, Euphemia (Effie) and their children would be greatly appreciated.

 

Many thanks and all the best,

 

Chris

 

On Mon, Feb 8, 2021 at 11:59 AM Janice McClelland <jan.mcclelland888@...> wrote:

Anne, that's great that you & Janet have confirmed links & solidified some connections.

I have to climb out of the tree for a bit as I have other commitments looming. Happy hunting to all~
Jan


Re: Currie / McVurich - please help

Iain MacIntosh
 

Hi Chris

Christ: I tried to get on to Ted Larson’s pages on Rootsweb, but encountered an error. 

I have attached an Excel spreadsheet of this data which  I downloaded a number of years ago from Steve’s site.

 

Regards

 

Iain MacIntosh

 

 

From: Islay@Scotland-Genealogy.groups.io <Islay@Scotland-Genealogy.groups.io> On Behalf Of Chris MacDougall
Sent: 12 February 2021 17:44
To: Islay@scotland-genealogy.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Islay] Currie / McVurich - please help

 

Hello everyone,

 

I am hunting down a McDougall/Currie link, and I am wondering if any of you might have these people in your respective trees, plus further information.

 

Euphemia (Effie) Currie married Hugh McDougal at Kilmeny in 1855, and they had a daughter named Anne in 1860. There might be other children, I am not sure.

 

The other items I am not sure of are Hugh's parents and Effie's parents. As everyone well knows, the number of McDougalls and Curries on Islay makes this extremely difficult to follow. My own Jura McDougalls went to Islay in the 1840s, also muddying the waters a bit.

 

Any information, or leads for me to research further, that you may have regarding Hugh, Euphemia (Effie) and their children would be greatly appreciated.

 

Many thanks and all the best,

 

Chris

 

On Mon, Feb 8, 2021 at 11:59 AM Janice McClelland <jan.mcclelland888@...> wrote:

Anne, that's great that you & Janet have confirmed links & solidified some connections.

I have to climb out of the tree for a bit as I have other commitments looming. Happy hunting to all~
Jan


Re: Currie / McVurich - please help

Iain MacIntosh
 

Hi Chris

You can find other children of this family in the births pages of the late  Ted Larson’s pages which are linked through Steve Gilchrist’s webpages on Rootsweb.  http://freepages.family.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~tlarson/bdm/

 

As their youngest was born in 1872, you will probably be able to search for High and Euphemia’s deaths on Scotlandspeople website.  As they would be statutory death records (1855 onwards), they will give you the parents names.

 

Good luck

 

Iain MacIntosh

 

From: Islay@Scotland-Genealogy.groups.io <Islay@Scotland-Genealogy.groups.io> On Behalf Of Chris MacDougall
Sent: 12 February 2021 17:44
To: Islay@scotland-genealogy.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Islay] Currie / McVurich - please help

 

Hello everyone,

 

I am hunting down a McDougall/Currie link, and I am wondering if any of you might have these people in your respective trees, plus further information.

 

Euphemia (Effie) Currie married Hugh McDougal at Kilmeny in 1855, and they had a daughter named Anne in 1860. There might be other children, I am not sure.

 

The other items I am not sure of are Hugh's parents and Effie's parents. As everyone well knows, the number of McDougalls and Curries on Islay makes this extremely difficult to follow. My own Jura McDougalls went to Islay in the 1840s, also muddying the waters a bit.

 

Any information, or leads for me to research further, that you may have regarding Hugh, Euphemia (Effie) and their children would be greatly appreciated.

 

Many thanks and all the best,

 

Chris

 

On Mon, Feb 8, 2021 at 11:59 AM Janice McClelland <jan.mcclelland888@...> wrote:

Anne, that's great that you & Janet have confirmed links & solidified some connections.

I have to climb out of the tree for a bit as I have other commitments looming. Happy hunting to all~
Jan


Re: Currie / McVurich - please help

Chris MacDougall
 

Hello everyone,

I am hunting down a McDougall/Currie link, and I am wondering if any of you might have these people in your respective trees, plus further information.

Euphemia (Effie) Currie married Hugh McDougal at Kilmeny in 1855, and they had a daughter named Anne in 1860. There might be other children, I am not sure.

The other items I am not sure of are Hugh's parents and Effie's parents. As everyone well knows, the number of McDougalls and Curries on Islay makes this extremely difficult to follow. My own Jura McDougalls went to Islay in the 1840s, also muddying the waters a bit.

Any information, or leads for me to research further, that you may have regarding Hugh, Euphemia (Effie) and their children would be greatly appreciated.

Many thanks and all the best,

Chris

On Mon, Feb 8, 2021 at 11:59 AM Janice McClelland <jan.mcclelland888@...> wrote:
Anne, that's great that you & Janet have confirmed links & solidified some connections.

I have to climb out of the tree for a bit as I have other commitments looming. Happy hunting to all~
Jan


Re: Coultersay, Islay

Glynn Currie
 

Thanks Cas,

I would love to see it some day.

Glynn

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Cas Houston
Sent: February 12, 2021 1:18 AM
To: Islay@Scotland-Genealogy.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Islay] Coultersay, Islay

 

Hi,

> Coultersay - It is a lovely spot with an open view to Loch Indaal and

> is named clearly with a sign at the entrance road on "Street View" on

> Google maps .

> Regards

> Charles Houston

 

--

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https://www.avg.com

 

 

 

 

 

 


Re: Coultersay

Glynn Currie
 

Thanks Ian,

I appreciate your assistance.

Glynn Currie

Vancouver Island, Canada.

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Ian McEachern
Sent: February 11, 2021 4:47 PM
To: islay@scotland-genealogy.groups.io
Subject: [Islay] Coultersay

 

Hello Glynn,

I have two maps of Islay, both clearly show Coultersay.

Must be a pretty place.

Ian McEachern

Western Australia

 

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Re: Coultersay, Islay

Cas Houston
 

Hi,

Coultersay - It is a lovely spot with an open view to Loch Indaal and is named clearly with a sign at the entrance road on "Street View" on Google maps .

Regards

Charles Houston
--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com


Coultersay

Ian McEachern
 

Hello Glynn,

I have two maps of Islay, both clearly show Coultersay.

Must be a pretty place.

Ian McEachern

Western Australia




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Re: North Carolina + Scotland Symposium

Malcolm Campbell
 

Thanks for this Toni

Looks interesting.

May attend

Bought Fleming's book Eldon Connections at an OGS conference years ago. 

My best,

Malcolm CAMPBELL

---------- Original Message ----------
From: tsinclair@...
Date: February 10, 2021 at 3:21 PM


Hi everyone,

I recently heard from Bill Caudill of the Scottish Heritage Center
(St.Andrews University) in North Carolina that they will continue to
hold their annual (30th) Scottish Heritage Symposium, but in a
"virtual" format for the first time this year on March 20. We are
invited to "Take the opportunity to spend the day with some of the top
scholars in the USA, Scotland and Canada on topics relative to
Scottish and Scottish-American history and genealogy."

Among the list of these excellent scholars is Dr. Rae Fleming, author
of "Eldon Connections", and local historian and specialist on the
migrations between Islay, NC and Ontario in the19th century. He
actually lives in Eldon Township! Other topics include Gaelic
literature and lore in the American South; dna found in Scotland and
the Scottish diaspora; Gaelic hymn and song traditions found in the
Carolinas; and the connections between Native Americans of the
Carolinas and their emigrant Highland Scot neighbours.

You can learn more details about the speakers at:
https://www.sa.edu/scottish-heritage/ and click on the Brochure Link.
The schedule and registration information you will find under 2021
Schedule link. Or, email me, and I'll forward these details to you.
The cost is only $20 US.

My husband, Sandy and I have personally attended two of these
symposiums in past years, and they were well worth the trip. Now we
can enjoy this interesting conference in the comfort of our own homes!
I am also a member of their NC Scottish Heritage Society, which puts
out an excellent Journal 3 times a year, called The Argyll Colony
Plus. They give Islay quite a lot of coverage in many diverse aspects
of Islay life and history. In the most recent issue is a list of many
Immigrant Ships from Scotland to North Carolina 1739-1820 by Dr. R.J.
Cain of Raleigh, NC. Among them it mentions 2 ships of interest to
us:
- 1769, the Mally sailed from Islay for NC, "full of passengers to
settle there." (from Scots Magazine,1769)
- 1774, the Carolina Packet sailed from Campbeltown, with 62
passengers from Islay and Mull, (Newsome)


The 1818 ship that brought the "Eldon" folks to NC wasn't listed. In
1820 there were 2 Sinclair brothers who left Kilchoman parish for NC
with their young families, presumeably following their friends who
left two years earlier. However, they did not migrate north to
Ontario, and there are many descendants still living in the Carolinas
and further afield. And Bill Caudill is one of them. It's a small
world.

Toni








>


Re: North Carolina + Scotland Symposium

M. Diane Rogers
 

Thank you, Toni. I'll be there. 
I'm particularly looking forward to Dr. Bruce Durie's talk - "The Confusing DNA of the Scots" !
Diane R



North Carolina + Scotland Symposium

tsinclair@...
 

Hi everyone,

I recently heard from Bill Caudill of the Scottish Heritage Center (St.Andrews University) in North Carolina that they will continue to hold their annual (30th) Scottish Heritage Symposium, but in a "virtual" format for the first time this year on March 20. We are invited to "Take the opportunity to spend the day with some of the top scholars in the USA, Scotland and Canada on topics relative to Scottish and Scottish-American history and genealogy."

Among the list of these excellent scholars is Dr. Rae Fleming, author of "Eldon Connections", and local historian and specialist on the migrations between Islay, NC and Ontario in the19th century. He actually lives in Eldon Township! Other topics include Gaelic literature and lore in the American South; dna found in Scotland and the Scottish diaspora; Gaelic hymn and song traditions found in the Carolinas; and the connections between Native Americans of the Carolinas and their emigrant Highland Scot neighbours.

You can learn more details about the speakers at: https://www.sa.edu/scottish-heritage/ and click on the Brochure Link. The schedule and registration information you will find under 2021 Schedule link. Or, email me, and I'll forward these details to you. The cost is only $20 US.

My husband, Sandy and I have personally attended two of these symposiums in past years, and they were well worth the trip. Now we can enjoy this interesting conference in the comfort of our own homes! I am also a member of their NC Scottish Heritage Society, which puts out an excellent Journal 3 times a year, called The Argyll Colony Plus. They give Islay quite a lot of coverage in many diverse aspects of Islay life and history. In the most recent issue is a list of many Immigrant Ships from Scotland to North Carolina 1739-1820 by Dr. R.J. Cain of Raleigh, NC. Among them it mentions 2 ships of interest to us:
- 1769, the Mally sailed from Islay for NC, "full of passengers to settle there." (from Scots Magazine,1769)
- 1774, the Carolina Packet sailed from Campbeltown, with 62 passengers from Islay and Mull, (Newsome)


The 1818 ship that brought the "Eldon" folks to NC wasn't listed. In 1820 there were 2 Sinclair brothers who left Kilchoman parish for NC with their young families, presumeably following their friends who left two years earlier. However, they did not migrate north to Ontario, and there are many descendants still living in the Carolinas and further afield. And Bill Caudill is one of them. It's a small world.

Toni


Re: Caullorsay, Islay

Glynn Currie
 

Thank you.

Glynn

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Roger via groups.io
Sent: February 9, 2021 2:07 AM
To: Islay@Scotland-Genealogy.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Islay] Caullorsay, Islay

 

Hi, here is my two pence worth – Corogortan in 1851 with its current name being Corra Ghoirtein in Kilarrow parish – Hope this helps – NR 3145/6960.

Regards Roger

 

Sent: Monday, February 08, 2021 4:03 PM

Subject: Re: [Islay] Caullorsay, Islay

 

On a related note, in his memoirs (written in the 1850s), my GGG grandfather, Daniel (Mac)Niven indicated that when his father (Duncan MacNiven) married his mother (Flora Campbell) he quit working at sea and moved to his father's (Malcolm MacNiven) farm in a place called "Cargostan", Islay. My GGG grandfather said he was born there in 1766.

 

I have been unable to identify any location/homestead with this name on Islay.  My GGG grandfather was in his 80s when he wrote this, and although he was a native Gaelic speaker, he had not set foot on Islay since he emigrated to the U.S. in 1791, so clearly time could have clouded his memory of the spelling of the place. 

 

When I visited Islay with my family we enquired about this location and the best anyone could offer was that it was possibly Conisby, where some MacNiven's still lived at the time.  This may be, but in his memoirs my GGG grandfather described how his mother apparently suffered from severe post partum depression, and shortly after he was born she nearly threw him off a cliff near the farmstead.  There does not appear ot be a cliff near Conisby, so I suspect that is not the "Cargostan" that my GGG grandfather was referring to.

 

I'd appreciate any insights you may have about this.  Thanks very much.

 

Daniel Niven

 


Re: Caullorsay, Islay

Glynn Currie
 

 

You are correct. My original spelling was based on my reading of old style hand writing. Your spelling is the correct one.

Glynn

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: J LOCHRIDGE via groups.io
Sent: February 9, 2021 2:29 AM
To: Islay@Scotland-Genealogy.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Islay] Caullorsay, Islay

 

I have come into this discussion late but is what is shown as Caullorsay, otherwise known as Coultorsay (Cultorsa) Kilchoman?

Johan





------ Original Message ------
From: "Roger via groups.io" <rogermcwee99@...>
To: Islay@Scotland-Genealogy.groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, 9 Feb, 21 At 10:07
Subject: Re: [Islay] Caullorsay, Islay

Hi, here is my two pence worth – Corogortan in 1851 with its current name being Corra Ghoirtein in Kilarrow parish – Hope this helps – NR 3145/6960.

Regards Roger

Sent: Monday, February 08, 2021 4:03 PM

Subject: Re: [Islay] Caullorsay, Islay

On a related note, in his memoirs (written in the 1850s), my GGG grandfather, Daniel (Mac)Niven indicated that when his father (Duncan MacNiven) married his mother (Flora Campbell) he quit working at sea and moved to his father's (Malcolm MacNiven) farm in a place called "Cargostan", Islay. My GGG grandfather said he was born there in 1766.

I have been unable to identify any location/homestead with this name on Islay. My GGG grandfather was in his 80s when he wrote this, and although he was a native Gaelic speaker, he had not set foot on Islay since he emigrated to the U.S. in 1791, so clearly time could have clouded his memory of the spelling of the place.

When I visited Islay with my family we enquired about this location and the best anyone could offer was that it was possibly Conisby, where some MacNiven's still lived at the time. This may be, but in his memoirs my GGG grandfather described how his mother apparently suffered from severe post partum depression, and shortly after he was born she nearly threw him off a cliff near the farmstead. There does not appear ot be a cliff near Conisby, so I suspect that is not the "Cargostan" that my GGG grandfather was referring to.

I'd appreciate any insights you may have about this. Thanks very much.

Daniel Niven

 

 

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